Re: Unbuddied issue workflow

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Re: Unbuddied issue workflow

Johan Corveleyn-3
On Thu, May 18, 2017 at 9:59 AM, Johan Corveleyn <[hidden email]> wrote:

> On Wed, May 17, 2017 at 10:56 AM, Daniel Shahaf <[hidden email]> wrote:
>> Stefan Sperling wrote on Tue, May 16, 2017 at 17:59:28 +0200:
>>> On Tue, May 16, 2017 at 03:49:32PM +0000, Daniel Shahaf wrote:
>>> > We could probably change the "File an issue" jira workflow to prevent
>>> > people from filing unbuddied issues, and instead, having jira tell them
>>> > to email users@.  I'm thinking of interjecting something into the
>>> > "Create issue" jira flow.
>>>
>>> Yes please! Is that easy to do?
>>
>> I don't know.  Does anybody volunteer to look into this?  (By reading
>> jira docs or asking Ivan or asking infra.)
>
> I have a bit of experience with JIRA from work, but not that much in
> the area of customizing these interactions ... Depends heavily on how
> infra sets things up too of course.
> Anyway, I'll try to have a look (but if nothing moves in the next
> couple of days, other hands would certainly be welcome).
>
> Also, for newcomers it's hard to find our JIRA, coming from our own
> website. The page http://subversion.apache.org/reporting-issues.html
> doesn't even mention JIRA (the search links all correctly query JIRA,
> but it's kind of hidden). There should at least be a link there to
> simply go to JIRA to create new issues (it should probably mention
> that you'll need to create an account if you don't have one already).
> Right now there is no "create new issue" link, you have to click on
> one of the search links, and go from there through the JIRA UI. The
> "Reporting issues" page is mainly focused on deterring ... enforcing
> our buddy guidelines etc ... but it's not very welcoming.

Hmm, seems issues are still filed unbuddied regularly, without passing
by users@. Interjecting a screen in the "Create Issue" workflow seems
indeed a good idea. I'll try to take this up with infra.

--
Johan
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Re: Unbuddied issue workflow

Johan Corveleyn-3
On Wed, Aug 30, 2017 at 11:14 PM, Johan Corveleyn <[hidden email]> wrote:

> On Thu, May 18, 2017 at 9:59 AM, Johan Corveleyn <[hidden email]> wrote:
>> On Wed, May 17, 2017 at 10:56 AM, Daniel Shahaf <[hidden email]> wrote:
>>> Stefan Sperling wrote on Tue, May 16, 2017 at 17:59:28 +0200:
>>>> On Tue, May 16, 2017 at 03:49:32PM +0000, Daniel Shahaf wrote:
>>>> > We could probably change the "File an issue" jira workflow to prevent
>>>> > people from filing unbuddied issues, and instead, having jira tell them
>>>> > to email users@.  I'm thinking of interjecting something into the
>>>> > "Create issue" jira flow.
>>>>
>>>> Yes please! Is that easy to do?
>>>
>>> I don't know.  Does anybody volunteer to look into this?  (By reading
>>> jira docs or asking Ivan or asking infra.)
>>
>> I have a bit of experience with JIRA from work, but not that much in
>> the area of customizing these interactions ... Depends heavily on how
>> infra sets things up too of course.
>> Anyway, I'll try to have a look (but if nothing moves in the next
>> couple of days, other hands would certainly be welcome).
>>
>> Also, for newcomers it's hard to find our JIRA, coming from our own
>> website. The page http://subversion.apache.org/reporting-issues.html
>> doesn't even mention JIRA (the search links all correctly query JIRA,
>> but it's kind of hidden). There should at least be a link there to
>> simply go to JIRA to create new issues (it should probably mention
>> that you'll need to create an account if you don't have one already).
>> Right now there is no "create new issue" link, you have to click on
>> one of the search links, and go from there through the JIRA UI. The
>> "Reporting issues" page is mainly focused on deterring ... enforcing
>> our buddy guidelines etc ... but it's not very welcoming.
>
> Hmm, seems issues are still filed unbuddied regularly, without passing
> by users@. Interjecting a screen in the "Create Issue" workflow seems
> indeed a good idea. I'll try to take this up with infra.

See https://issues.apache.org/jira/browse/INFRA-14990.

After chatting on #asfinfra, they first have to investigate the
possibilities in JIRA. If it's at all possible, we'll have to come up
with a good text (perhaps depending on the screen real-estate we can
afford for this). Any suggestions?

We could take inspiration from the big yellow box on
http://subversion.apache.org/reporting-issues.html or from
http://subversion.apache.org/docs/community-guide/issues.html I guess
...

--
Johan
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Re: Unbuddied issue workflow

Daniel Shahaf-2
Johan Corveleyn wrote on Wed, 30 Aug 2017 23:44 +0200:
> After chatting on #asfinfra, they first have to investigate the
> possibilities in JIRA. If it's at all possible, we'll have to come up
> with a good text (perhaps depending on the screen real-estate we can
> afford for this). Any suggestions?
>

"Has one of the Subversion committers asked you to file an issue?

( ) yes   ( ) no"    # radio button

then if they tick "(x) no", display:

"The issue tracker is reserved for use by the Subversion developers.
Please send any usage questions, bug reports, and support questions,
directly to the mailing list <a href="...">[hidden email]</a>.  Thanks!".

... and disable (grey out) the "Next >" or "Continue" button.

Needs some wordsmithing, but the main point is to only show the
"301 Moved Permanently" message after the user has pressed a radio
button; I hope that would lead to better success rates.

---

Also, we could ask Ivan; he did our jira migration so he might have an
idea off the top of his head.

> We could take inspiration from the big yellow box on
> http://subversion.apache.org/reporting-issues.html or from
> http://subversion.apache.org/docs/community-guide/issues.html I guess
> ...


Cheers,

Daniel
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Re: Unbuddied issue workflow

Stefan Sperling
On Wed, Aug 30, 2017 at 11:36:17PM +0000, Daniel Shahaf wrote:
> Johan Corveleyn wrote on Wed, 30 Aug 2017 23:44 +0200:
> > After chatting on #asfinfra, they first have to investigate the
> > possibilities in JIRA. If it's at all possible, we'll have to come up
> > with a good text (perhaps depending on the screen real-estate we can
> > afford for this). Any suggestions?
> >
>
> "Has one of the Subversion committers asked you to file an issue?

> "The issue tracker is reserved for use by the Subversion developers.

Anyone, not just comitters, can be issue buddies.
The idea is just to get any two people to agree on-list that there is a bug.
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Re: Unbuddied issue workflow

Daniel Shahaf-2
Stefan Sperling wrote on Thu, 31 Aug 2017 12:05 +0200:

> On Wed, Aug 30, 2017 at 11:36:17PM +0000, Daniel Shahaf wrote:
> > Johan Corveleyn wrote on Wed, 30 Aug 2017 23:44 +0200:
> > > After chatting on #asfinfra, they first have to investigate the
> > > possibilities in JIRA. If it's at all possible, we'll have to come up
> > > with a good text (perhaps depending on the screen real-estate we can
> > > afford for this). Any suggestions?
> > >
> >
> > "Has one of the Subversion committers asked you to file an issue?
>
> > "The issue tracker is reserved for use by the Subversion developers.
>
> Anyone, not just comitters, can be issue buddies.
> The idea is just to get any two people to agree on-list that there is a bug.

Good point; we should phrase the question differently.
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Re: Unbuddied issue workflow

Johan Corveleyn-3
On Fri, Sep 1, 2017 at 2:23 AM, Daniel Shahaf <[hidden email]> wrote:

> Stefan Sperling wrote on Thu, 31 Aug 2017 12:05 +0200:
>> On Wed, Aug 30, 2017 at 11:36:17PM +0000, Daniel Shahaf wrote:
>> > Johan Corveleyn wrote on Wed, 30 Aug 2017 23:44 +0200:
>> > > After chatting on #asfinfra, they first have to investigate the
>> > > possibilities in JIRA. If it's at all possible, we'll have to come up
>> > > with a good text (perhaps depending on the screen real-estate we can
>> > > afford for this). Any suggestions?
>> > >
>> >
>> > "Has one of the Subversion committers asked you to file an issue?
>>
>> > "The issue tracker is reserved for use by the Subversion developers.
>>
>> Anyone, not just comitters, can be issue buddies.
>> The idea is just to get any two people to agree on-list that there is a bug.
>
> Good point; we should phrase the question differently.

Things are moving along ...

I got a suggestion from Ivan and added that to the infra ticket [1].
Gavin has now added a note to the Create Issue screen for us.
This appears in red letters (with a mailto link on "Subversion Users")
if you select "Subversion" in the Create Issue screen:

"Please ensure you have discussed on the Subversion Users mailing list
first BEFORE creating this ticket."

WDYT? Tweaks to the text?

[1] https://issues.apache.org/jira/browse/INFRA-14990

--
Johan
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Re: Unbuddied issue workflow

Stefan
On 03/09/2017 11:20, Johan Corveleyn wrote:

> On Fri, Sep 1, 2017 at 2:23 AM, Daniel Shahaf <[hidden email]> wrote:
>> Stefan Sperling wrote on Thu, 31 Aug 2017 12:05 +0200:
>>> On Wed, Aug 30, 2017 at 11:36:17PM +0000, Daniel Shahaf wrote:
>>>> Johan Corveleyn wrote on Wed, 30 Aug 2017 23:44 +0200:
>>>>> After chatting on #asfinfra, they first have to investigate the
>>>>> possibilities in JIRA. If it's at all possible, we'll have to come up
>>>>> with a good text (perhaps depending on the screen real-estate we can
>>>>> afford for this). Any suggestions?
>>>>>
>>>> "Has one of the Subversion committers asked you to file an issue?
>>>> "The issue tracker is reserved for use by the Subversion developers.
>>> Anyone, not just comitters, can be issue buddies.
>>> The idea is just to get any two people to agree on-list that there is a bug.
>> Good point; we should phrase the question differently.
> Things are moving along ...
>
> I got a suggestion from Ivan and added that to the infra ticket [1].
> Gavin has now added a note to the Create Issue screen for us.
> This appears in red letters (with a mailto link on "Subversion Users")
> if you select "Subversion" in the Create Issue screen:
>
> "Please ensure you have discussed on the Subversion Users mailing list
> first BEFORE creating this ticket."
>
> WDYT? Tweaks to the text?
>
> [1] https://issues.apache.org/jira/browse/INFRA-14990
>
Looks good to me. Slight improvement might be to change the link to
point to https://subversion.apache.org/mailing-lists.html#users-ml
instead of the user-lists mail address, since that link actually
describes what the mailing list is (for newbies not too familiar with
mailing lists) and how to subscribe to it.

Regards,
Stefan

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Re: Unbuddied issue workflow

Johan Corveleyn-3
On Sun, Sep 3, 2017 at 11:33 AM, Stefan <[hidden email]> wrote:
> On 03/09/2017 11:20, Johan Corveleyn wrote:
...

>> This appears in red letters (with a mailto link on "Subversion Users")
>> if you select "Subversion" in the Create Issue screen:
>>
>> "Please ensure you have discussed on the Subversion Users mailing list
>> first BEFORE creating this ticket."
>>
>> WDYT? Tweaks to the text?
>>
>> [1] https://issues.apache.org/jira/browse/INFRA-14990
>>
> Looks good to me. Slight improvement might be to change the link to
> point to https://subversion.apache.org/mailing-lists.html#users-ml
> instead of the user-lists mail address, since that link actually
> describes what the mailing list is (for newbies not too familiar with
> mailing lists) and how to subscribe to it.

Yes, good idea. I'll wait a little bit more to see if there is more
feedback, before passing this along to infra.

--
Johan
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Re: Unbuddied issue workflow

Johan Corveleyn-3
On Mon, Sep 4, 2017 at 12:58 AM, Johan Corveleyn <[hidden email]> wrote:

> On Sun, Sep 3, 2017 at 11:33 AM, Stefan <[hidden email]> wrote:
>> On 03/09/2017 11:20, Johan Corveleyn wrote:
> ...
>>> This appears in red letters (with a mailto link on "Subversion Users")
>>> if you select "Subversion" in the Create Issue screen:
>>>
>>> "Please ensure you have discussed on the Subversion Users mailing list
>>> first BEFORE creating this ticket."
>>>
>>> WDYT? Tweaks to the text?
>>>
>>> [1] https://issues.apache.org/jira/browse/INFRA-14990
>>>
>> Looks good to me. Slight improvement might be to change the link to
>> point to https://subversion.apache.org/mailing-lists.html#users-ml
>> instead of the user-lists mail address, since that link actually
>> describes what the mailing list is (for newbies not too familiar with
>> mailing lists) and how to subscribe to it.
>
> Yes, good idea. I'll wait a little bit more to see if there is more
> feedback, before passing this along to infra.

Ok, the link has now been changed to point to
https://subversion.apache.org/mailing-lists.html#users-ml

The text is now: "Please ensure you have discussed on the
<link>mailing list</link> first BEFORE creating this ticket."

I think we can close this issue / thread now :-). Of course, feel free
to reopen if you feel like it.

--
Johan